TRANSCRIPT: TV INTERVIEW - SKY NEWS - OCTOBER 25, 2020

E&OE TRANSCRIPT
TELEVISION INTERVIEW
SKY NEWS WITH KIERAN GILBERT
SUNDAY, 25 OCTOBER 2020

SUBJECTS: National Integrity Commission; Morrison Government scandals JobSeeker; Anthony Albanese.

KIERAN GILBERT, HOST: Tony Burke, thank you for your time. Let's talk about local politics. Last week, dominated by Federal Labor saying that you want to see some action towards an independent corruption watchdog federally. Do you think that many people would accept the government's argument that they've had a few other priorities this year to manage, like COVID-19?
 
BURKE: I don't think anyone can accept that as an excuse. Let's face it, the government has found time to bring in new laws and new legislation to deal with students acting corruptly at universities, if they cheat on their exams. There’s a new corruption body there. They've been willing to act on providing big advertising campaigns. This draft legislation, which is all about exposing corruption, was given to the government in December last year and they’ve kept it secret. It's about exposing what's going on. And their response to it is to keep it secret. All they have to do is print it off on their own computer, walk into the parliament, and table it and the public conversation can start. Committees, everything else has been working during this time within the parliament. And it's a deliberate decision from Mr Morrison to try to go on a go-slow when it comes to dealing with corruption.

GILBERT: But you would accept it’s not the easiest thing to put together, a corruption watchdog for the federal level. Obviously the state watchdogs, we've seen some of them, you know, have that star chamber element. Would you like to see that avoided when it comes to a federal corruption commission? Or would you be happy with that sort of star chamber approach?

BURKE: It needs to be powerful, and it needs to be independent. In terms of all the intricacies of what it's able to deal with and how it chooses to operate itself, the starting point is for the draft legislation to not be kept secret. That's the starting point on all of this. We've had different attempts in the parliament to start the debate on this. What we didn't know until Senate estimates was that they had the legislation and now we're keeping it secret.

GILBERT: Did you think the Prime Minister handled the situation around Australia Post appropriately? With the Cartier watches. He was very angry about that. Appalled by it he said. And the CEO’s been stood aside. Would you've done the same?

BURKE: Talk about confected anger. I mean, the example, the standards, come from the top. They come from the top in any organization, and they come from the top in a government. So of course the actions that have been taken in Australia Post in response to the Cartier watches needed to happen. But what about the other examples of corruption that if we already had an anti-corruption body would be being dealt with now. You've got the Leppington Triangle, the airport rort deal. You've got the the water buybacks, where they paid Versace prices for water effectively from The Reject Shop. You've got the way they did the sports rorts, with the colour-coded spreadsheets to back marginal seats. You think the enormity of all of these, these issues that Scott Morrison is wanting to sweep under the carpet. Think of it in these terms. We were told in Senate estimates of those watches were worth $3000. That's what we were told in the original evidence. The land deal, the overpriced land deal near Badgery’s Creek - $3 million to $30 million - that's worth 10,000 Cartier watches. And Scott Morrison won’t establish a body to be able to deal with it.

GILBERT: Yeah, sure. It's an inflated price. It's a ridiculous price. I think everyone's recognised that. But there's no suggestion that there at this stage that corruption was involved is there?

BURKE: Well, no one knows how this has happened yet. But what we do know is this: we asked the Deputy Prime Minister about the decision that this would not be done through compulsory acquisition that would be done through a private deal. He says that decision wasn't made by him as Minister, it was made by the previous minister. That's what he says on the floor of Parliament. We then go to Paul Fletcher, who was the minister at the time, to start asking about what he knew and what contact he's had with the company. And we get told well, you're not allowed to ask him because it's not his portfolio anymore. The only way you get to the bottom of these issues is to establish a body that the government is trying to suppress at the moment.

GILBERT: Let's look at a few other matters. The JobSeeker payment, the government's going to give an update on JobSeeker and its plans for it in the mid-year budget update in December, just a month or so away. There are reports today that more than 10 coalition MPs want the JobSeeker payment cut back because it's being a disincentive to get people into jobs. Should it stay where it is, reduced? What's your view?
BURKE: Now’s not the time to be cutting support. For people who are unemployed at the moment, you know, these Liberals don't seem to understand it's not their fault. There's something like one job for every eight applicants out there at the moment. And it's not only, the support isn't only helping them, you walk up and down the streets of any retail strip in Australia and people will tell you that the fact that there's been some extra money around for people on the payment system during this period has made a huge difference to demand. Now it's going to be a long time before we get tourists into the country again, before we've actually got international demand starting to drive our economy, we’re relying on domestic demand. And now is not the time to be cutting support for people.
 
GILBERT: $200 fortnight increase for the JobSeeker, according to research done recently, that would cost $7 billion a year. When will Labor put some numbers to your view on what should happen to the JobSeeker or the dole as it used to be known?
 
BURKE: Well what we can say right now is now is not the time, absolutely not the time to be withdrawing support. It's a disaster for those individuals and it's bad for Australia's economy. And we don't know what the state of the economy is going to be by the time we get to the next election. But as we've said, these sorts of decisions of withdrawing support mean that the Morison Recession will be longer and deeper than it would otherwise have been.

GILBERT: When you look at a lot of the budget, Labor hasn't really been too critical of a lot of it, saying, you know, you got a trillion dollars in debt and not a lot to show for it. But beyond that, specific measures like the JobMaker wage subsidy, you've allowed that through the House of Reps, there's not really been a fight on anything.

BURKE: We argued for wage subsidies. So the fight has often been dragging the government to things that need to happen. So when we first started arguing for wage subsidies, the government was ridiculing the idea. That's why I have some hope if we keep pushing for a National Integrity Commission, we will get somewhere notwithstanding how much the government might think they've got to hide on on this particular issue. The other thing though, when you say what we put forward, when you get a recession, getting the economy moving again is a bit like push-starting an old manual car, and you've got to get the car into gear for the push-starting to work. Now, what Scott Morrison is doing is pushing a whole lot of money out. But if there's no reform attached to it, you don't get the engine running again. And that's what childcare is about. It's about making sure that no one is punished for working the fourth or fifth day.

GILBERT: Are you worried about where Labor is in terms of polling right now? Some 22 points behind Josh Frydenberg and Scott Morrison in terms of economic management, according to Latest Newspoll, 22 per cent behind as economic managers. Is that a worry for you?
 
BURKE: I'm not concerned as to where we're at right at the moment in terms of, there is a willingness from the public, and from everybody – we want governments to succeed. Because we see the consequences if they don't. But, I've gone for a long time in this place now, watching occasions where an opposition including us wins the election on every weekend except when it's held. And so to take things through methodically, to release our own commitments, not all at once, but issues that will make a huge difference in productivity, like the childcare announcement. That's the right pathway. And if you want an example of how we're actually going, you know where I sit in the chamber, I’m not far from the table at all. And I can hear a lot of the banter between Anthony Albanese and Scott Morrison. The other day, right at the end of question time, because Scott Morrison can get pretty angry by the end of question time, he looks across at Anthony just before he leaves and says, “I'm not afraid of you.” Now, that's not the sort of thing that you say when you’re feeling relaxed. And you think of the different times you've heard someone say that they're not afraid of someone – I've never heard them say it unless they’re feeling some pressure?
 
GILBERT: Well, that's the question. Is Anthony Albanese up to it, because a lot of your colleagues internally are having that debate right now. Is he up to the job? Can he win?
 
BURKE: Absolutely. We have the finest parliamentary performer of our generation as leader of the Labor Party. We have someone who from his own life story – the whole way through - Anthony knows what it is to be going through difficult times as Australians are going through right now. But he's been at the cabinet table. He's got the experience. And the thing that he showed in that budget reply speech is he’s also there for the big reforms.

GILBERT:  Tony Burke thanks for joining us.

BURKE: Great to be back.
 
ENDS